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	<title>Comments on: Trust and Values in the City? Who benefits from the City of London Corporation?</title>
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	<link>http://occupylondon.org.uk/archives/1053</link>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Ian</title>
		<link>http://occupylondon.org.uk/archives/1053#comment-4563</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Nov 2011 22:11:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://occupyLSX.org/?p=1053#comment-4563</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thank you. Apology accepted.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you. Apology accepted.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: if you don't agree with occupy</title>
		<link>http://occupylondon.org.uk/archives/1053#comment-4562</link>
		<dc:creator>if you don't agree with occupy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Nov 2011 01:51:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://occupyLSX.org/?p=1053#comment-4562</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Then you are either (a) ignorant (b) don&#039;t understand anything (c) are 1 of the 99% (d) are selfish and greedy ... we are all part of the 99%, except, if you don&#039;t agree ...

I think that&#039;s it? Did i miss anything?

Admittedly, I&#039;ll probably be attacked, told to pull my head out etc, but, I see no value in the movement .. there are no &quot;demands&quot; that have been made that I can even start get involved with ...

Sorry, I must be either 1 or more of the first statement.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Then you are either (a) ignorant (b) don&#8217;t understand anything (c) are 1 of the 99% (d) are selfish and greedy &#8230; we are all part of the 99%, except, if you don&#8217;t agree &#8230;</p>
<p>I think that&#8217;s it? Did i miss anything?</p>
<p>Admittedly, I&#8217;ll probably be attacked, told to pull my head out etc, but, I see no value in the movement .. there are no &#8220;demands&#8221; that have been made that I can even start get involved with &#8230;</p>
<p>Sorry, I must be either 1 or more of the first statement.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ian</title>
		<link>http://occupylondon.org.uk/archives/1053#comment-4561</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Nov 2011 23:21:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://occupyLSX.org/?p=1053#comment-4561</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[There was a time when bankers set one country against another as a threat against default.
The City of London , that Citadel, requires the monarch to cross a red line, very symbolic dont you think. there was a time past when national debt was a monarch&#039;s debt. Any guesses how the &quot;City&quot; was able to extract &quot;concessions&quot; over the past centuries.
Now we have ....&quot;to big to fail&quot; , if the &quot;Euro&quot; collapses, the Union collapses.
...God forbid we just cancel the debt. ...tidy up and get on with it......the subterfuge must go one, and the &quot;one world project-government&quot; must stay on track.

Many world leaders have announced the project so please do not think that this is a &quot;conspiracy&quot; theory. A little research will show the following Bush Snr., Clinton etc. propossing a one world system.

As we move forward I see the only hope of harnessing the &quot;power to creat credit&quot; for good, if it is democractised to the individual. Just as each citizen has a right to vote he must also  obtain the right to create credit for himself, his community, state, and nation. This powermust be used in the first instance for the obtaining of the necessary pre-requisites for civilized life. i.e. health, shelter, education, security.
If a nation can feed itself, then it can meet all these requirments without injustice.

Cheers]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There was a time when bankers set one country against another as a threat against default.<br />
The City of London , that Citadel, requires the monarch to cross a red line, very symbolic dont you think. there was a time past when national debt was a monarch&#8217;s debt. Any guesses how the &#8220;City&#8221; was able to extract &#8220;concessions&#8221; over the past centuries.<br />
Now we have &#8230;.&#8221;to big to fail&#8221; , if the &#8220;Euro&#8221; collapses, the Union collapses.<br />
&#8230;God forbid we just cancel the debt. &#8230;tidy up and get on with it&#8230;&#8230;the subterfuge must go one, and the &#8220;one world project-government&#8221; must stay on track.</p>
<p>Many world leaders have announced the project so please do not think that this is a &#8220;conspiracy&#8221; theory. A little research will show the following Bush Snr., Clinton etc. propossing a one world system.</p>
<p>As we move forward I see the only hope of harnessing the &#8220;power to creat credit&#8221; for good, if it is democractised to the individual. Just as each citizen has a right to vote he must also  obtain the right to create credit for himself, his community, state, and nation. This powermust be used in the first instance for the obtaining of the necessary pre-requisites for civilized life. i.e. health, shelter, education, security.<br />
If a nation can feed itself, then it can meet all these requirments without injustice.</p>
<p>Cheers</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ian</title>
		<link>http://occupylondon.org.uk/archives/1053#comment-4560</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Nov 2011 22:53:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://occupyLSX.org/?p=1053#comment-4560</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Extract from the  - Michael Jounal

It&#039;s time people knew the money trick

    Banks hold the power of life and death over the economy

Colin Barclay-Smith

Colin Barclay-Smith is an Australian journalist who started studying Douglas&#039;s Social Credit proposals during the first years of the Depression. He was so convinced of the value of this doctrine that he founded, in 1932, a journal to diffuse it, the New Era, which had at one time over 30,000 subscribers. In 1934, Barclay-Smith accompanied Douglas in his tour of Australia and New Zealand. Barclay-Smith died on May 19, 1957 in Sydney, at the age of 64. A brilliant writer, Barclay-Smith wrote several booklets on various aspects of Social Credit. The last one, It&#039;s time they knew, was published a few months before his death. This booklet was republished and updated several times under the title The Money Trick. (This book is available from our office, in English or in Polish, for $9, postage included.) Here are excerpts from this booklet:

by Colin Barclay-Smith

It&#039;s time the people of Australia knew the alarming facts. Test your own knowledge of these facts by the following questions:

Do you know that no bank lends money deposited with it?

Do you know that when a bank lends money it CREATES it out of nothing?

Do you know that bank loans are merely pen and ink entries in the credit columns of a bank&#039;s ledger? They have no other existence.

Do you know that practically all the money in the community comes into circulation as a debt to the banks?

Do you know that money loaned by a Government bank is just as much a debt to the people as if it were loaned from a private bank?

Do you know that “fixed deposits” are a plausible screen to hide the creation of credit?

Did it ever occur to you that the banks enjoy this unique facility of creating credit and putting the nation progressively into debt-bondage because they create FINANCIAL credit against the REAL credit created by the people?

Do you realize that every time a Government borrows money for a public work, the people are debited with the liability (in perpetuity), but are never credited with the value of the asset?

Do you know that every repayment of a bank loan cancels the amount of the loan out of existence?

Do you know that Treasury Notes are Government I.O.U.&#039;s — national pawn tickets for pledging the assets of the country to the banks for the loan of OUR OWN financial credit?

Do you know that banks purchase bank sites, build premises, and acquire assets at no real cost whatever to themselves — by the simple process of honoring their own checks?

You may dismiss these affirmations as “incredible”, or “absurd”, but if you will read on, each one will be proved beyond all shadow of doubt.

Most of us have grown up with only the vaguest notions of money. We are fairly certain that it is the Government&#039;s right to print notes and mint coins. For the rest, our knowledge is distinctly foggy.

Most people, for example, labor under the impression that the only money in the community is notes, silver, and copper. But this is a very, very small part of the community&#039;s money.

In fact, notes, silver, and copper — legal tender — is used for less than five per cent of the total purchases made. Over 95 per cent of all business is done by checks.

This check currency is really bank-created money — bank credit — but it functions exactly the same as legal tender money. Banking authorities of world-wide repute state that banks can and do create credit up to nine or ten times their cash resources.

Banks go to great pains to perpetuate the fiction that they are merely “the custodians of their customers&#039; deposits” — that they lend these deposits, and that their profit consists of the difference in the rate of interest which they pay to depositors, and the interest they receive from borrowers. Such an idea is quite wrong, and it is the popular acceptance of this major monetary fallacy which gives rise to most of the false notions upon the subject of money.

 The facts about money are as follows: —

(1) Banks do not lend money deposited with them.

(2) Every bank loan or overdraft is a creation of entirely new money (credit), and is a clear addition to the amount of money in the community.

(3) No depositor&#039;s money is used when a bank lends money.

(4) Practically all the money in the community begins its life as an interest-bearing debt to the banks.

The technique of a bank loan

 All that a bank does in lending anybody, say $1,000, is to open an account in the borrower&#039;s name — if he hasn&#039;t already got an account — and write Limit: $1,000, across the top of the ledger. The borrower is now free to operate and overdraw on this account to the limit indicated.

 When the account is drawn on the check, and in turn the check is lodged in another account at the same or another bank, a “deposit” is thus created, and the supply of money increased. Thus bank loans create “deposits”, which plainly are not the source of loan money but, rather, the other way around, they are the outcome of loans.

Now for the authorities

Now for the unassailable authorities on this matter of the creation of credit by the banks.

Governor Eccles, a one-time head of the Federal Reserve Bank Board of the United States, said: “The banks can create and destroy money. Bank credit is money. It&#039;s the money we do most of our business with, not with that currency which we usually think of as money.” (Given in evidence before a Congressional Committee)

Mr. R.G. Hawtrey, previously Assistant Under-Secretary to the British Treasury, in his Trade Depression and the Way Out, says: “When a bank lends, it create money out of nothing.”

In his book, The Art of Central Banking, Hawtrey also wrote: “When a bank lends, it creates credit. Against the advance which it enters amongst its assets, there is a deposit entered in its liabilities. But other lenders have not this mystical power of creating the means of payment out of nothing. What they lend must be money that they have acquired through their economic activities.”

Lord Keynes, the economist and one-time Board Member of the Bank of England, states: “There can be no doubt that all deposits are created by the banks.”

Professor Frederick Soddy, the eminent physicist of Oxford University, wrote: “Is it possible in these days of disbelief in physical miracles really to caricature institutions which pretend to lend money, and do not lend it but create it? And when it is repaid them, de-create it? And who have achieved the physically impossible miracle thereby, not only of getting something for nothing, but also of getting perennial interest from it?”

The community&#039;s life blood

The business world cannot function without bank credit, and every person in the community is equally dependent upon it.

Stop, or even restrict, bank overdrafts for one week, and there would be a nation-wide crisis. Continue the restriction for three months, and this nation would be plunged into a depression, with unemployment and bankruptcy for thousands.

Such a crisis happened in the early thirties, as millions of the older generation remember with sorrow and bitterness. You may remember that during the Depression, there was no shortage of goods. The shops and stores were full. But credit had been restricted by the banks. The life blood did not flow freely, and industry died, and unemployment was staggering.

Bank credit is the life blood of the community, and if the flow of blood is restricted, the patient&#039;s life is jeopardized.

How money begins

Now let us look at this credit business a little more closely. How does it come about?

 There is an old economic tag that money originates in production, and is cancelled in consumption. Practically all the community&#039;s money has its roots in production. Most money sees the light of day as a “producer credit”. In other words, it begins its life as a debt to a bank, and from the moment it is released as a book entry in a bank&#039;s ledger, the credit created by the bank and loaned to a company or individual travels through the production system, much of it being used for consumption, and is finally cancelled when the debt is repaid to the bank by the borrower.

That industry — both primary and secondary — cannot function on its own resources which is proven by the universal need it has of bank overdraft accommodation (i.e., bank loans).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Extract from the  &#8211; Michael Jounal</p>
<p>It&#8217;s time people knew the money trick</p>
<p>    Banks hold the power of life and death over the economy</p>
<p>Colin Barclay-Smith</p>
<p>Colin Barclay-Smith is an Australian journalist who started studying Douglas&#8217;s Social Credit proposals during the first years of the Depression. He was so convinced of the value of this doctrine that he founded, in 1932, a journal to diffuse it, the New Era, which had at one time over 30,000 subscribers. In 1934, Barclay-Smith accompanied Douglas in his tour of Australia and New Zealand. Barclay-Smith died on May 19, 1957 in Sydney, at the age of 64. A brilliant writer, Barclay-Smith wrote several booklets on various aspects of Social Credit. The last one, It&#8217;s time they knew, was published a few months before his death. This booklet was republished and updated several times under the title The Money Trick. (This book is available from our office, in English or in Polish, for $9, postage included.) Here are excerpts from this booklet:</p>
<p>by Colin Barclay-Smith</p>
<p>It&#8217;s time the people of Australia knew the alarming facts. Test your own knowledge of these facts by the following questions:</p>
<p>Do you know that no bank lends money deposited with it?</p>
<p>Do you know that when a bank lends money it CREATES it out of nothing?</p>
<p>Do you know that bank loans are merely pen and ink entries in the credit columns of a bank&#8217;s ledger? They have no other existence.</p>
<p>Do you know that practically all the money in the community comes into circulation as a debt to the banks?</p>
<p>Do you know that money loaned by a Government bank is just as much a debt to the people as if it were loaned from a private bank?</p>
<p>Do you know that “fixed deposits” are a plausible screen to hide the creation of credit?</p>
<p>Did it ever occur to you that the banks enjoy this unique facility of creating credit and putting the nation progressively into debt-bondage because they create FINANCIAL credit against the REAL credit created by the people?</p>
<p>Do you realize that every time a Government borrows money for a public work, the people are debited with the liability (in perpetuity), but are never credited with the value of the asset?</p>
<p>Do you know that every repayment of a bank loan cancels the amount of the loan out of existence?</p>
<p>Do you know that Treasury Notes are Government I.O.U.&#8217;s — national pawn tickets for pledging the assets of the country to the banks for the loan of OUR OWN financial credit?</p>
<p>Do you know that banks purchase bank sites, build premises, and acquire assets at no real cost whatever to themselves — by the simple process of honoring their own checks?</p>
<p>You may dismiss these affirmations as “incredible”, or “absurd”, but if you will read on, each one will be proved beyond all shadow of doubt.</p>
<p>Most of us have grown up with only the vaguest notions of money. We are fairly certain that it is the Government&#8217;s right to print notes and mint coins. For the rest, our knowledge is distinctly foggy.</p>
<p>Most people, for example, labor under the impression that the only money in the community is notes, silver, and copper. But this is a very, very small part of the community&#8217;s money.</p>
<p>In fact, notes, silver, and copper — legal tender — is used for less than five per cent of the total purchases made. Over 95 per cent of all business is done by checks.</p>
<p>This check currency is really bank-created money — bank credit — but it functions exactly the same as legal tender money. Banking authorities of world-wide repute state that banks can and do create credit up to nine or ten times their cash resources.</p>
<p>Banks go to great pains to perpetuate the fiction that they are merely “the custodians of their customers&#8217; deposits” — that they lend these deposits, and that their profit consists of the difference in the rate of interest which they pay to depositors, and the interest they receive from borrowers. Such an idea is quite wrong, and it is the popular acceptance of this major monetary fallacy which gives rise to most of the false notions upon the subject of money.</p>
<p> The facts about money are as follows: —</p>
<p>(1) Banks do not lend money deposited with them.</p>
<p>(2) Every bank loan or overdraft is a creation of entirely new money (credit), and is a clear addition to the amount of money in the community.</p>
<p>(3) No depositor&#8217;s money is used when a bank lends money.</p>
<p>(4) Practically all the money in the community begins its life as an interest-bearing debt to the banks.</p>
<p>The technique of a bank loan</p>
<p> All that a bank does in lending anybody, say $1,000, is to open an account in the borrower&#8217;s name — if he hasn&#8217;t already got an account — and write Limit: $1,000, across the top of the ledger. The borrower is now free to operate and overdraw on this account to the limit indicated.</p>
<p> When the account is drawn on the check, and in turn the check is lodged in another account at the same or another bank, a “deposit” is thus created, and the supply of money increased. Thus bank loans create “deposits”, which plainly are not the source of loan money but, rather, the other way around, they are the outcome of loans.</p>
<p>Now for the authorities</p>
<p>Now for the unassailable authorities on this matter of the creation of credit by the banks.</p>
<p>Governor Eccles, a one-time head of the Federal Reserve Bank Board of the United States, said: “The banks can create and destroy money. Bank credit is money. It&#8217;s the money we do most of our business with, not with that currency which we usually think of as money.” (Given in evidence before a Congressional Committee)</p>
<p>Mr. R.G. Hawtrey, previously Assistant Under-Secretary to the British Treasury, in his Trade Depression and the Way Out, says: “When a bank lends, it create money out of nothing.”</p>
<p>In his book, The Art of Central Banking, Hawtrey also wrote: “When a bank lends, it creates credit. Against the advance which it enters amongst its assets, there is a deposit entered in its liabilities. But other lenders have not this mystical power of creating the means of payment out of nothing. What they lend must be money that they have acquired through their economic activities.”</p>
<p>Lord Keynes, the economist and one-time Board Member of the Bank of England, states: “There can be no doubt that all deposits are created by the banks.”</p>
<p>Professor Frederick Soddy, the eminent physicist of Oxford University, wrote: “Is it possible in these days of disbelief in physical miracles really to caricature institutions which pretend to lend money, and do not lend it but create it? And when it is repaid them, de-create it? And who have achieved the physically impossible miracle thereby, not only of getting something for nothing, but also of getting perennial interest from it?”</p>
<p>The community&#8217;s life blood</p>
<p>The business world cannot function without bank credit, and every person in the community is equally dependent upon it.</p>
<p>Stop, or even restrict, bank overdrafts for one week, and there would be a nation-wide crisis. Continue the restriction for three months, and this nation would be plunged into a depression, with unemployment and bankruptcy for thousands.</p>
<p>Such a crisis happened in the early thirties, as millions of the older generation remember with sorrow and bitterness. You may remember that during the Depression, there was no shortage of goods. The shops and stores were full. But credit had been restricted by the banks. The life blood did not flow freely, and industry died, and unemployment was staggering.</p>
<p>Bank credit is the life blood of the community, and if the flow of blood is restricted, the patient&#8217;s life is jeopardized.</p>
<p>How money begins</p>
<p>Now let us look at this credit business a little more closely. How does it come about?</p>
<p> There is an old economic tag that money originates in production, and is cancelled in consumption. Practically all the community&#8217;s money has its roots in production. Most money sees the light of day as a “producer credit”. In other words, it begins its life as a debt to a bank, and from the moment it is released as a book entry in a bank&#8217;s ledger, the credit created by the bank and loaned to a company or individual travels through the production system, much of it being used for consumption, and is finally cancelled when the debt is repaid to the bank by the borrower.</p>
<p>That industry — both primary and secondary — cannot function on its own resources which is proven by the universal need it has of bank overdraft accommodation (i.e., bank loans).</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: human of planet earth</title>
		<link>http://occupylondon.org.uk/archives/1053#comment-4559</link>
		<dc:creator>human of planet earth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Nov 2011 13:04:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://occupyLSX.org/?p=1053#comment-4559</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I like that line.......&#039;play nice now&#039;   says a lot about the mindset of a lot of the &#039;anti occupy movement&#039;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like that line&#8230;&#8230;.&#8217;play nice now&#8217;   says a lot about the mindset of a lot of the &#8216;anti occupy movement&#8217;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: human of planet earth</title>
		<link>http://occupylondon.org.uk/archives/1053#comment-4558</link>
		<dc:creator>human of planet earth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Nov 2011 12:59:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://occupyLSX.org/?p=1053#comment-4558</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[dee
dont be giving him ideas now, he is probably an MP and will make an announcement it was his idea !! ;)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dee<br />
dont be giving him ideas now, he is probably an MP and will make an announcement it was his idea !! <img src='http://occupylondon.org.uk/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: human of planet earth</title>
		<link>http://occupylondon.org.uk/archives/1053#comment-4557</link>
		<dc:creator>human of planet earth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Nov 2011 12:55:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://occupyLSX.org/?p=1053#comment-4557</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[idea: abolish MPs and political parties
benefits: no more corrupt MPs !]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>idea: abolish MPs and political parties<br />
benefits: no more corrupt MPs !</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: human of planet earth</title>
		<link>http://occupylondon.org.uk/archives/1053#comment-4556</link>
		<dc:creator>human of planet earth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Nov 2011 12:45:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://occupyLSX.org/?p=1053#comment-4556</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Jeremiah,
So true, especially the foaming at the mouth like a rabid dog, I can actually picture &#039;her&#039; like that.
&#039;She&#039; is truly scary !]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeremiah,<br />
So true, especially the foaming at the mouth like a rabid dog, I can actually picture &#8216;her&#8217; like that.<br />
&#8216;She&#8217; is truly scary !</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: human of planet earth</title>
		<link>http://occupylondon.org.uk/archives/1053#comment-4555</link>
		<dc:creator>human of planet earth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Nov 2011 12:16:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://occupyLSX.org/?p=1053#comment-4555</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Very good point about time span of shareholding.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very good point about time span of shareholding.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: desperate</title>
		<link>http://occupylondon.org.uk/archives/1053#comment-4554</link>
		<dc:creator>desperate</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Nov 2011 09:59:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://occupyLSX.org/?p=1053#comment-4554</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Dave

Not speaking on behalf of the movement, but from my own observations and feelings, I would say that this is not a matter for the intellect but for the heart.

I would say that if there is a demand, it is a demand for a response from the heart, not the intellect.

I would also say that I sense from various sources that this is being achieved in more and more people ~ so, if that is the aim, then it is proving successful.

The fact that the camp in London is an annoyance to some is serving to convey that it cannot be conveniently ignored.  The fact that its there demands a response.  That is the point.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dave</p>
<p>Not speaking on behalf of the movement, but from my own observations and feelings, I would say that this is not a matter for the intellect but for the heart.</p>
<p>I would say that if there is a demand, it is a demand for a response from the heart, not the intellect.</p>
<p>I would also say that I sense from various sources that this is being achieved in more and more people ~ so, if that is the aim, then it is proving successful.</p>
<p>The fact that the camp in London is an annoyance to some is serving to convey that it cannot be conveniently ignored.  The fact that its there demands a response.  That is the point.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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